What We ‘Lose’ & ‘Gain’…

Maggie Judge: 00:00:00

Do we grieve what we feel we have lost? Or do we learn to celebrate? What we let go? Welcome back. Let's navigate a really meaty topic of the things we lose and gain along the way as we navigate a breast cancer journey. So Deena, I'm interested in as you think about your healing journey, which obviously is still going on.

Dina Legland: 00:00:28

Absolutely.

Maggie Judge: 00:00:30

How would you characterize the things that you lost?

Dina Legland: 00:00:37

It's funny that you should ask that question. Because I've been doing a lot of soul searching lately with, you know, working with my clients, and even just for myself, and the word identity comes up. And I actually felt like I've lost who I was, or who I am being more as, you know, as our audience has heard me, say, being a nurse and being an Indian T and being the primary caregiver. That's all I knew. That's who I am. And I actually felt like, now what? Now who I am, I've changed. I've changed stress drastically. I've changed which you probably, I would think that you would probably feel the same way I changed physically, emotionally, mentally, and spiritually. Like, it all came rushing in. And I was just talking about this the other day on how when I, when I heard the words, remission, and so did everybody else around me whether it was work, family, friends, whatever. They wanted the old Dena back. Yeah. Dina, could you do this? Do you know, let's do this let you name it. The entire gamut of Dina's back. She's okay. And then dump on. Okay. And when we talk about gains in a little while, I'm going to talk about how I changed that into a gain. Interesting. Yeah, it, it wasn't easy. It truly was I struggled with my identity. You know, being the caregiver, now I'm being taken care of. And who am I? And that was just one of many. But Maggie, I actually, I know a lot about you. But I'm wondering if there's something that I don't know, when it comes to what you felt you lost, as you were going through this journey?

Maggie Judge: 00:03:03

Well, there, there probably is. But the thing, you know, that comes to mind right away Dina is I love how you said that you turn something into a game, because when we think of these things that we lose, it is devastating, upfront. So when you think like, for me, it was identity as well, because I used to just focus on taking care of everyone around me, and not taking care of myself. And I also think about my work, I was addicted, that was my vise I was a workaholic. And so the fact that I could no longer do that made me feel less than and then identity wise to your point, too. So there's the career aspect of that, depending on where you are in your career, if you can perform or not perform at the levels you are accustomed to, but then also how we look. And the and feel physically because I also felt like I lost some confidence because of the loss of hair. Because when you're weak and you're you get a little more pale, you lose your eyebrows, your eyelashes, all those physical changes, right? But then also I lost strength. So I felt like my resilience. That whole feeling of weakness did not sit well with me.

Dina Legland: 00:04:32

Well, that's understandable.

Maggie Judge: 00:04:33

Yeah. And so So I think, you know, you and I both I think identity characterizes a lot of it. The other thing I do feel that I lost was my ability to sort of hide behind what I call my four Ps, ice I spent my life pleasing, proving, performing and producing. And I would just literally cycle through those things in my life and move, you know, that was that it was exhausting, but it was who I was. So I don't I just I feel like that was a biggest thing I lost. But when you look back at it, it was like, thank goodness, I did. But I, to your point about turning it into a game, right.

Dina Legland: 00:05:32

One of the other things as you were talking, I realized, and it's amazing on how this journey, you kind of block things out. And then when you start talking to others who have gone through the process, other things start to surface. And while you while you were talking, I said, I got this, this feeling that I lost faith in others. Because I had people in my life, believe it or not, not treat me well, as I was going through this journey. And people who left me, didn't want to talk to me didn't want to be around. So like I said, as you were talking, I was just getting those, you know, goosebumps. And it was just like something else is coming up. And it just, it just popped in my head. About, I'm a very trusting person, I want people to love me like I love them. And I had to let go of these couple of things that happened in my life because I started to lose faith in it. And I was just like, all right, Some, somebody's telling me a story, here are a lesson here or something I have to figure out. And I did. And once we go back into or stop the gains here, I'll get into that a little bit more.

Maggie Judge: 00:07:02

I think that's a brilliant point. Because I didn't even think about, like you said, until we start talking through this right and reflecting back on it. It's always healing to do so. And I feel like there were a lot of there were a lot of changes in the people like in who I was close to end or who it was surprising who I ended up getting them either the most support, or the most. I mean, even just the care and concern and all of that once you once you get to that point where we can finally allow that love and support in the people that it came from surprise me.

Dina Legland: 00:07:44

Yes, it surprised me too.

Maggie Judge: 00:07:46

And the people that didn't maybe come from was also as equally as surprising, right? So yeah. And that's a hard one too, because as we've talked about in a previous episode, it's like, in some cases, people just don't know how to deal with that. And so it's not a it's not a negative on them. It's not a you are a bad person. It's that. In some cases, they don't know how to and

Unknown: 00:08:12

yeah, that is

Maggie Judge: 00:08:13

what it is. Right?

Dina Legland: 00:08:14

Exactly. And it's the point of not taking it personally. It has nothing to do with a person who's going through the journey. And unfortunately, most of us are like, what's wrong with me? How come they're not here? Or how come they're not talking? You know, it's things like that. Absolutely.

Maggie Judge: 00:08:36

Because you want things to be normal, right? We're in the beginning, especially you want things to be normal, you want to be treated normal, you don't want to be viewed as weak and writing whatever. So. So, so Deena, based on those things, let's shift into gains. What what things when you look back do you feel like you truly gained from that journey.

Dina Legland: 00:09:04

I actually gained clarity on making myself a priority. Beautiful. It wasn't easy. It took time it took practice, it took some you know, positive self talk, and being able to set up my healthy boundaries and say, No. and No, really, for many, many decades was not in my vocabulary. Same here, like you said, one of the PS people pleaser. I said yes. I said yes to everything and anything anybody threw at me. And it was like no, I I got sick And I believe at times, my body was telling me that I needed to take care of myself. And that I came first. So the whole self love and self care. There was certain things that I learned how to do that I never did before. So whether that was journaling, taking a bubble bath, going outside in nature, and also really taking a look when somebody wanted the old Dena back. If they wanted me to do something, I got into the habit of saying, I have to check my schedule, I'll get back to you.

Maggie Judge: 00:10:47

Even if you can buy a little time, right?

Dina Legland: 00:10:51

Because I would jump and say Yes, right away. And it's, it's easier for some people out there. Like my daughters and my husband, they have no problem saying no. Specially if they don't want to do it.

Maggie Judge: 00:11:05

Yep. Yep. My husband is the same way. My daughter's the same way. Yeah, it's like, no. Oh, okay. Are you sure about that? No, is a complete sentence that is hard to use?

Dina Legland: 00:11:19

Yes. So what I'd like our audience to know, Maggie is, what were your gains? As you went through this?

Maggie Judge: 00:11:35

For me, it I don't even know what words to use to describe the immense love for myself. And I say immense, because I'd never focused on it before. And so that shift to truly loving and as you say, caring for me, because in order to create the space to heal, we've got to figure out, what does that what does that look like to give ourselves that space and to make ourselves that priority? Right? Because that so for me, it started with huge intentionality around my schedule, because my schedule used to be controlled by all of the yeses, as you say, and taking everything on and just believing I'll get to what I need to get to in my time, I will always figure it out. And so really having some intentionality around my schedule, and what my priorities were, and to your point, the boundaries, like figuring out what boundaries do I need to set now? And for me, it was like, if it's not a Hell, yes, it has to be a no. Right. So I really feel like I gained more meaningful connection with me. And it's interesting, because connection is one of my core values. And, as is a passion, but I I focus on it again, with my interaction with others, not my interaction with me. So to me, that has been like my hugest game. And now, yeah, to your point, it wasn't easy. And it's still not easy. I still have to hold myself accountable. I still, because it evolves and it changes. And I do feel like I need to be gracious with myself, because I've grown a lot. I've come a long way. And I have practices in place, my healing habits that I I cherish and are have become non negotiable. That helped me keep a focus on that.

Dina Legland: 00:13:54

I am so glad you said the word non negotiable because as you were talking about those healthy habits, I'm going this is non negotiable. That's yeah. And it's amazing on when you were talking about core values for a moment. One of mine is trust. And I had to learn to trust myself. I was very trusting of others.

Maggie Judge: 00:14:25

Interesting.

Dina Legland: 00:14:28

And the point I'm trying to make is I had to trust myself to be okay, and nothing was going to disturb my surroundings. When I said no, your gut if this is not feeling good, and whatever that looks like for somebody because we're all different and we're all unique, but trust in yourself to make the decision for you. And I actually like you said it's ongoing healing. I say it all the time to myself probably a few times during the day care trust yourself, this is not something you want to do trust yourself to say no. Does it fit in your schedule? Does it serve you? Or is it going to drain you?

Maggie Judge: 00:15:17

And that's a great way to look at it is does it serve you? Or does it drain you and, and think about like, energy levels as we navigate this are already at an all time low. So being very mindful of those things that do drain us is a must. So that's, that's interesting about the Trust for self. And trust is you got,

Dina Legland: 00:15:39

yeah, you were talking about truly going within and learning how to love yourself, like you really had to look at that. And that's what I had to look inside of myself. Yeah, you know, the trust,

Maggie Judge: 00:15:54

while and going inside and figuring out that self care and self love. There are probably people out there that maybe maybe weren't good at self love and self care. But I think it's so key to know that or to to to recognize that it changes all the time. And it is so very unique to every single person, right? So it's really giving yourself the time and space to figure out what it looks like, over and over and over again.

Dina Legland: 00:16:25

Right. And one of the things that I truly needed to do, and you might do this as well, is that things go on my schedule, things go on my calendar, I have wake up at a certain time, workout at a certain time, stretch at a certain time. Journal breakfast, like, we don't really think about these things until something traumatic happens like a cancer journey of breast cancer journey or whatever. to then say, Nope, slow down. How to put this on my calendar. It's non negotiable. It's me time.

Maggie Judge: 00:17:06

Yep. Well, and you just ended with the thing that I was gonna say the meantime, I can't put the I love your level of like the details of what things you work in your schedule. But I have some anxiety I'm still working through on my schedule when I have too many things. So I literally have a block. And it's not even right now on my calendar. It's just I know, my non negotiable is me time in the morning. Right? And, you know, I don't show up to my desk until nine sometimes later. And I like that. And it's it's serving me and my healing well,

Dina Legland: 00:17:48

right, we just have to find the tools that work for the person, the individual. It's just like you said, I need to see it. When I do a block. Like you just said, Oh, I'll go do something else. Yeah, I won't stick to what I just said I was going to do. So you see how we're all very different and unique. Yell out? What a great conversation it is. And

Maggie Judge: 00:18:14

one thing that is is coming to mind here as we talk about the gains is when you think about now these things were saying that we did gain from it. If you go back to what we lost, we didn't really lose it. We didn't lose those things. We potentially just had a misrepresentation in our mindset about those things when you think about identity, for example.

Dina Legland: 00:18:46

Right? Exactly. They were things that we needed to let go of certain limited or limited beliefs. Mm hmm. So you're right about the word lose or lost. It's really a shift in letting go. To serve you better.

Maggie Judge: 00:19:08

Exactly. And I always say that I truly believe that cancer was my wake up call. But for me too. It's like the the diagnosis like breast cancer is devastating. I just can't imagine a person who it's not devastating for right but for me, the journey has been transformational. It has transformed me from who I once was, with all the things that weren't serving me into a better person. And I feel like I am I'm shifting into more of a life that represents my wholehearted loving my me showing up as my authentic me and what I mean.

Dina Legland: 00:19:57

Exactly because I feel the same exact way. Stick with me. I'm just as we're getting closer to the end of this conversation. I love what I have realized, is living with purpose. And that's what I truly learned and gained. Because like you said prior we we were just running around. Yeah. Serving everybody else.

Maggie Judge: 00:20:26

I always say I was reacting to life. And now I am more intentionally moving through it in a way that brings me more joy,

Dina Legland: 00:20:37

joy, joy, fulfillment, everything. Absolutely. Oh, so good.

Maggie Judge: 00:20:44

Yeah, this is fabulous. So I always appreciate and love these because like you said, things come up as we share these things. And I, I know, we're going to start asking our audience for input and, and just their own thoughts, they can always share their own thoughts. So please do share with us. If you've got reactions to this or additional questions. Remember to go check out our page and, and give us some thoughts or feedback.

Dina Legland: 00:21:13

Yes, it would be you know, it would be an honor, actually, to hear what that is, so that we can bring up even other topics that we might be not thinking of right now.

Maggie Judge: 00:21:25

Yeah. Yeah. And I feel like what's interesting is, I imagine like this web of everything we talked about could turn into, you know, 100 other topics. subtopics, whatever.

Dina Legland: 00:21:39

Absolutely. So episodes to come. Yes.

Maggie Judge: 00:21:42

All right. Well, thanks Dana. As and Q. Always a pleasure.